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An Interview with Jurgen Engler of Die Krupps
Posted: Sunday, March 09, 2008
By: Vlad McNeally

"The metal years were a phase, an experiment," states Jürgen Engler when asked about what's next. Engler is best known as the mastermind behind perhaps the longest-running industrial band ever, Die Krupps, whose last studio appearance was in the late '90s, at the end of their metal era. "I am more drawn to electronic sounds these days."

To some, it may come to a surprise that these 'Germaniacs' from Düsseldorf have been active longer than almost every "industrial" band in the scene. From beating Einstürzende Neubauten to be the first German band to press a record in the genre to spearheading the launch of EBM neck-and-neck with Front 242, and even to splicing metal with industrial right at the cusp of the '90s crossover movement, Die Krupps have miraculously managed to evolve and remain on the forefront of the underground music scene since its inception. However, after the release of 1997's metal-heavy Paradise Now, the group finally took a well-deserved break, one that many saw not as a hiatus, but as an ending. With Engler busy with his DKay.com side-project, the machinery remained dormant for eight years. It wasn't until 2005 that Engler and Die Krupps' other remainding founder, Ralf Dörper, would decide to awaken the project to coincide with the band's 25th anniversary. Enlivened by a new line-up, a score of European festival appearances, and a new anthology, Too Much History, chronicling their career to date, Engler takes a moment to catch us up on all things Krupps.

Since there's such a wealth of material scattered across your 25 years, how did you compile your career down to two CDs, and why did you choose to separate it in two volumes, one of 'metal' and one of 'electro'?

Engler: We picked the tracks that we used to play at our shows over the years and which the people associate with the name Die Krupps the most. Some of the other songs are personal favorites from certain periods. There is also some new material and two cover versions, Pop Will Eat Itself's track, 'Ich Bin ein Ausländer,' and 'The Anvil,' which was originally recorded by Visage in the '80s. The band Client joined us on that one. Douglas McCarthy of Nitzer Ebb is also doing a guest performance on the new version of 'Machineries of Joy.' The record was released in Europe as a double-CD, and as two separate CDs: one called The Electro Years, the other The Metal Years. We decided not to do this in the States, because people seem to be more open-minded there. Then again, the idea was originally a record company idea and seemed to make sense at the time.

Why did you choose the title Too Much History for these releases?

Engler: That's a funny little story. A management company played the demo of the album to the head of A&R at the record company Roadrunner in New York City, as we were looking for a deal. I don't want to mention the name. We thought it was a good idea to approach someone who is familiar with our music, since he had attended several of our shows in the past. I was told he liked the new versions of the Die Krupps classics, but he decided against signing us, because the band had 'too much history'! I thought that was the perfect title for this retrospective. We had been playing with ideas for a while, but that was the perfect title. Thanks, man, you know who you are!

Looking back over your history, what would you say are your favorite Die Krupps works? Are there any you wish got more recognition, or any that you feel got more time in the limelight than they deserved?

Engler: I have only live favorites and non-favorites. I enjoy playing 'Dawning of Doom,' 'Fatherland' and 'Crossfire' the most, because they are the ones that I can move to the best and still sing at the top of my lungs. 'Alive' is also a nice live track. I think all our songs echo the times when they were written, so they all have their good reasons to exist. I never listen to my own music after it is completed, because I tend to analyze too much, and then wish I could change things again. That is also one of the reasons why all tracks on the Too Much History album were re-recorded. To me, the songs finally sound the way they should have in the beginning. I am quite satisfied with the result. There is not a single original that I like better. That's a good sign. I am very critical about our own work.

Since this quite a monumental anniversary, what would you say would be your most memorable moments that define the legacy of Die Krupps for you?

Engler: When our first record made it Single of the Week in the British NME in 1981. When "Machineries of Joy" made it Top 10 in the U.S. Billboard Dance Charts in 1989. When we played our first big festival, the Dynamo in Holland, and 30,000 people went crazy to "Dawning of Doom" in 1993. When the album Odyssey of the Mind went Top 20 in Germany and pretty much the rest of Europe in 1995. When we did our first U.S. tour in 1995, and when we played our first festival again after the long break in 2005 and saw the fan-base still intact and people going crazy again over the old tunes. And last but not least, the latest shows in Europe last week: Paris, Utrecht, Sheffield, London... It was fantastic! We cannot wait to go back to the States and prove that Die Krupps is still a tough act to follow!

What would you say is your biggest accomplishment? Conversely, what's your biggest regret?

Engler: I think the fact that we have been ahead of our time several times. Creating true industrial music using metal percussion—our first album came out before the first Einstürzende Neubauten—then creating hard electronic dance music that would later be called EBM, and inventing what I called 'Metal Machine Music' by combining the elements of electro and metal makes me feel like we have accomplished something important. Commercial success is only one side of the coin. Artistically, our achievement is more satisfying. My only regret is that we had too long of a break with Die Krupps, since the last album was released in 1997. Then again, I released two albums with my other project, DKay.com, did loads of remixes for other acts, and played shows with my old punk band Male in between. We even found time to record a new album.

When you dissolved Die Krupps in 1997, was it your plan to put the band on hiatus? If not, how did its resurrection come about?

Engler: The plan was to never see each other anymore! Seriously, we had internal problems due to the endless touring we did at the time and the many problems that come with it. The band was split in two before I brought the story to a halt. Then again, at the time we had progressed into something I had started as an experiment, which was to turn an electro act like Die Krupps into a quasi-metal act. It actually worked, and in 1997 I saw the goal achieved, so there really wasn't much reason to continue going down the same road. That's when I started DKay.com. It was basically the pop side of the coin, closer to 'Fatherland' than to 'Paradise Now,' which felt like the right move, again, artistically. As the 25th anniversary came closer, I met with Ralf again, and we decided it was time to get this band together again, at least for some shows to promote a possible 'best of' album. The rest is already history. We are back!

Before the second resurrection of Die Krupps, you spent a few years and a couple of albums working as DKay.com. While it's never been officially announced as concluded, is it over?

Engler: I am going to start work on a new DKay.com album some time this year, if I get the chance. To me, there is still room musically; Die Krupps doesn't cover all the ground for me. But I don't want to say too much, since the new Die Krupps album covers new ground too. We are exploring niches that we haven't touched before. We will see what happens in the end. I see the picture, but it keeps changing. It is like Jackson Pollock using his brush without touching the canvas. You never quite know what it will look like in the end. But I can promise you, it will be a great album.

What does DKay.com offer you that Die Krupps does not, and vice versa?

Engler: Like I said, DKay.com at the time I started the project was like the pop side of the metal Die Krupps. The second album was more rock again, but still had a good amount of electronics and, if you want, was more '80s-oriented. Later, the idea of fusing the best of '80s style music and contemporary became quite popular. Right now, as we are working on the new Die Krupps album, it is really hard to say what one project can or cannot offer. It will show in the end. The direction the new Die Krupps material is taking is definitely not metal, but still aggressive; it still has guitars, but they are not the main ingredient. Don't expect a second Paradise Now!

One interview I came across of yours was quite interesting; rather than focusing upon Krupps, it instead revolved around your key position within the Düsseldorf punk scene as a member of your pre-DK project, Male. What exactly was it about that scene like back in the day that made it provide the world with such a rich crop of musicians?

Engler: I could write a book about it, so this will be hard to answer in a few sentences. The main difference was that we had the whole world as our enemies, which kept us going even harder against all conventions. We were about change, and we totally broke with the past. We trashed the records we used to treasure before and wanted to create a new world. When we crossed the street, we were spat at; when we played gigs, we got into fights with the audience. Nowadays, you can wear a mohawk at the cash register at Wal-Mart; who cares? Nowadays, you can make millions of dollars playing punk rock! We were constantly fighting with everyone and their fascist views. But it was the only way to create something new; you had to have an enemy! If the parents listen to the same music as their kids, basically rock music, how can they develop their own identity? Marilyn Manson can't shock your grandma anymore, at least not where I come from. When my punk band Male toured with The Clash at the end of the '70s, there was already a good amount of that spirit gone, and punk was accepted, so that was a good reason to start something new. It was a bunch of industrial noise, and we called it 'Stahlwerksinfonie.' Nobody seemed to like it in Germany. England loved it. Die Krupps were born.

What originally prompted you to move from punk to industrial, anyway, and was it difficult to make the transition?

Engler: The way we were treated by the crew of The Clash made me realize that we were not in the same boat anymore. We didn't get monitors, only the P.A., and only one white spot from the left side; that was it. Also, The Clash had night-liners, we had a little sedan; they had big amps and expensive guitars, we didn't; they had management, a famous producer, a big record company putting out their records, and so on. We had none of that. We were a real punk band, loved by the kids, with no ties to any bullshit corporation. We didn't need to hide our past. We had never played hippie rock and were not hippies turned punks. We were five years younger, grown up on Bowie, Roxy Music, New York Dolls and glam-rock. We were the real deal. I still love The Clash's music, though. Going from punk to Die Krupps wasn't that hard, because I did exactly what I had done before. I broke with my past, we locked ourselves into an old bunker for a while and tried to create something that had not been done before. I brought in a ton of scrap metal and we started jamming. The title Stahlwerksinfonie, which means 'Steel Mill Symphony', existed before the 'noise' was even written. We wanted to create the atmosphere of a steel mill from the inside. We had preserved the punk spirit, but the music sounded much different. I still try to go back to that initial punk feeling when I write, sometimes, although it is a lot harder nowadays to break with your past. It is 30 years older now!

Also, what is the Düsseldorf scene like today, and how does it differ from when Die Krupps began? Would it be the same if you begun Die Krupps there today?

Engler: There is not really an interesting scene here anymore. Back then, it was a handful of bands working on creating a new and better world. There were Deutsch Amerikanische Freundschaft, Die Krupps, Liaison Dangereuses, Propaganda, and not to forget Neu and Kraftwerk, who were all coming out of Düsseldorf. Nowadays, there are lots of bands, but they don't seem to be able to create something new and exciting. The Internet and globalization of things might be one of the problems here. I think you really have to lock yourself away again and separate from the pack to become your own. Also, don't use everything that is available. To create your own identity, choose one synth instead of twenty different ones. It will make you sound like you. Or build your own, like Kraftwerk and we did.

You have had a home and studio in Austin, Texas as well. How is life in Texas compared to Düsseldorf, and what misconceptions do you find people have about both Germany and the USA?

Engler: I love Austin for numerous reasons. It is definitely not what you'd expect Texas to be. It's a liberal place, a university town with lots of young and artistic people. I felt right at home there. I moved there in 1995. I used to have an apartment in New York City for four years before that. I like both places for different reasons. Austin gives me what I need in terms of quality lifestyle, whereas New York gives you more opportunities, but also headaches if you don't have enough money. Düsseldorf is comparable to New York in terms of cost of living, but cannot offer you a fraction of the possibilities. That's a curse, but also the reason why there were so many good bands coming out of there. You have to do something with your life not to turn mad. Spend all day in the studio and create; but you have to be very sensitive to find inspiration. Düsseldorf is not a very inspiring place anymore. Where are all the enemies?!

As a world citizen, what do you make of the current state of things? In the '90s, you hoped that the decade would bring people together? Are you still optimistic?

Engler: It did bring people together via the Internet. Myspace does that very well. But you must ask yourself if Myspace was created by the government to monitor all the subversive 'elements.' They are easier to spot now, and who is linked to whom. It is genius, if you think about it. But who knows who is really behind all that? I think religion will always keep people separated, although it is supposed to do the opposite, and as long as the governments of the world use the religious problems as vehicles to fight their wars to make money, this will not end. But then there is also a good chance we will have a one world government in the future. There is our enemy!

Since you've always been rather outspoken about your political views, have you ever given thought about getting into politics yourself?

Engler: Very interesting thought. I think that all 'good' politicians started out thinking they could change the world, but in the end they ended up at the Bilderberger meetings, compromising and losing. I think these people are so powerful, it is hard to resist them, so everybody goes by their rules sooner or later. I must say it is tempting to do differently. Very tempting.

I've heard that along with this double retrospective release, you're also planning a live DVD release of your 1997 tour, along with possibly a video collection as well. Is there any truth to that, and furthermore, why is the live DVD focused on a tour from back then, as opposed to one of your current shows?

Engler: What you read is true. In the meantime, we've had several new shows filmed, and one coming up in Berlin this next weekend. We may even release two DVDs. I am not sure yet, but I think we have enough footage for two. I personally prefer the new shows to the 'metal' shows of the '90s. In my opinion, we currently have the strongest line-up to date. Then again, there are fans that loved us for the music we put out back then, too, so we will have to satisfy more than just my own personal collection's needs! The 1997 Berlin show was filmed by the infamous Jörg Buttgereit of Nekromantik fame, by the way!

Since the last incarnation of Die Krupps was partially spawned through your interest in various types of metal-based music, do you find anything in the current music world inspirational?

Engler: Very little, to be honest. The last album that blew me away in the past couple of years was the new Siouxsie album. I absolutely love it. I didn't expect much from her anymore, but this album taught me differently. I didn't listen to much of her music after we toured with The Banshees in 1982. I first saw them in 1978, and they were the best punk act I had ever seen. That was before their first album came out. The Clash were great, and even more was Wire, but The Banshees blew them all away at the time. But when we were, again, treated like a shitty support band—we were only given the house lights and monitors—we decided to quit the tour. When I heard of her solo album, I thought I'd give it a listen. I think it is very inspired and inspiring. When I write new music, I don't really get inspired by other people's music. I do get into my record collection sometimes and dig out stuff from the past that strikes me as interesting again. It can be a title, like Lou Reed's Metal Machine Music, back then, which inspired me to write real metal and machine music, or just cover artwork. In the end, it will all look and sound different and 'Die Krupps' anyway.

Speaking of your return single, at the time of its announcement, I was rather surprised to read about the reappearance of Douglas McCarthy. How did this collaboration come to exist, and why did you choose to use 'Machineries of Joy' as the starting point in your return?

Engler: We re-recorded 'Machineries of Joy' for the Too Much History album, and since the original was a collaboration with Nitzer Ebb, we wanted to have Douglas join us on the track again. I picked him up after a Fixmer/McCarthy gig in a city not far from Düsseldorf and took him to our studio. He actually joined us on stage for 'Machineries' at a festival we played in Belgium. It was fun!

You mentioned work on a new Die Krupps studio album. Are the new tracks from '5 Millionen' and 'The Great Divide' from Too Much History an indication of your future?

Engler: The new album is planned for a September or October release. Half of it is already completed. '5 Millionen' and 'The Great Divide' are not really the direction of the album, but there are some similarities. But as I already stated, the album is still likely to change as time progresses. We don't stand still.

Finally, how do you intend on celebrating Krupps' 30th anniversary?

Engler: Do a world tour this time! We will definitely tour again a lot more in the years to come than we did in the past two years. Now that we have a U.S. release, we will hopefully also tour there again. I am really looking forward to that. It may make sense, though, to wait until the new album is released. In Europe, we still have a strong fan-base, and we still play big festivals. I cannot tell how things are in the USA for us. The music scene there changes so fast, but this may also be to our advantage. Hope to see you all again!